Classic Jazz/Finger style Jazz

Roland Dyens dialoguait avec les membres du forum en Novembre 2010.
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Roland Dyens dialoguait avec les membres du forum en Novembre 2010. Les discussions auxquelles Roland a participé sont maintenant verrouillées, parce que Roland n'est pas là pour y participer.
Sobers

Classic Jazz/Finger style Jazz

Message par Sobers » mar. 23 novembre 2010, 10:02

Bonjour Monsieur Dyens,

In the English forum in a topic called “Jazz Guitarists” we talked about pros and cons of playing Finger style Jazz.
http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/v ... =1&t=47375

Sir,
What do you think about this subject?
Do you think there are any disadvantages of playing Classic Jazz or Finger style Jazz?
Why do you think that this style of playing Jazz is not well established?
Is there any Guitar institute/conservatory/university where this style is practiced?

(I asked these questions in English so I can quote Monsieur Dyens later)

Merci beaucoup

Sobers

Roland Dyens

Re: Classic Jazz/Finger style Jazz

Message par Roland Dyens » mar. 23 novembre 2010, 20:38

Sobers a écrit :Bonjour Monsieur Dyens,

Hi Sobers,

In the English forum in a topic called “Jazz Guitarists” we talked about pros and cons of playing Finger style Jazz.
http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/v ... =1&t=47375

Sir,
What do you think about this subject?
Don't know yet :wink:

Do you think there are any disadvantages of playing Classic Jazz or Finger style Jazz?
Why that ?
What do you mean actually Sobers ? Shall I understand you consider the fact of playing various types of music on a guitar as something tricky ?


Why do you think that this style of playing Jazz is not well established?
What do you mean again ? :?: Well established what ? If you mean Jazz guitar, then I do believe it's not "less well established" (well..or better established) than the classical guitar could be these days.
On the other hand, if you mean the fact of playing Jazz music on a classical type guitar is not well established, then it's a different issue.
I do believe a few people manage to do what great Charlie Byrd did in the 60's actually, no doubt on that. But I think it's a great challenge (plus just a good plan) to play Jazz music on a"Spanish" guitar. And why won't it be a good thing after all ?
I recorded my Jazz arrangements on a "regular" classical guitar as far as I know :)

Or maybe I misunderstood what you meant.
:desole: if so but I'm afraid your question(s) weren't 100% clear to be honest. To me at least :)


Is there any Guitar institute/conservatory/university where this style is practiced?

ATLA is a very good school located in Pigalle (Paris) (besides I used to be a teacher for a while there). I presume it's a piece of cake to get relevant informations about this school through Google.

(I asked these questions in English so I can quote Monsieur Dyens later)

Merci beaucoup
You're welcome dear.


Roland Dyens



Sobers

Sobers

Classic Jazz/Finger style Jazz

Message par Sobers » mer. 24 novembre 2010, 14:30

Dear Monsieur Dyens,

Actually I was talking about playing Jazz in Classical type guitar and you are the right person to answer these questions.
Thank you for answering them.

1) By asking about the disadvantages I mean actually ……… what many people say about playing Jazz in acoustic Classical guitar, that Classical guitar is a mellow instrument,……. It lacks the punch or attack needed in Jazz,……… the speed technique is not competent enough,……. Improvising by fingers is not easy etc.

I think these are disadvantages of a player but not of an instrument. Therefore I asked is there any disadvantage of the style or the approach according to you?

2) About ……….. this style is not well established.
When we talk about Jazz Piano we understand a person playing Jazz (composition and improvisations) in an acoustic Piano. It is a natural thing. The electronic keyboard is the second or third thought/choice.
But when we talk about Jazz guitar we don’t get the picture of Jazz in acoustic Classical guitar so easily.
Why is that? Why do you think that Jazz is mostly played in plectrum guitar technique? Is that because polyphonic improvisation is the hardest act?

I am quoting myself a bit from here http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/v ... e&start=30
Sobers a écrit : I think we are talking about Right Hand finger techniques of playing guitar.

In Classical guitar we have mainly:
Appoyando
Tirando
Arpeggio
Tremolo

In Flamenco guitar we can add to the above:
Rasgueado
Alzapua
4 note tremolo/5 note tremolo
Application of different complex arpeggios
Picado (and also few more techniques such as Golpe etc.)

In Fingerstyle/Country guitar we can experience:
Bass line and melody line balance
Cross finger technique and Inside Out finger picking
Hybrid finger technique (with thumb pick etc.)

Now from all of this right hand technique one thing is sure that the music will be Polyphonic.
2 or 3 Part harmonies can be applied and the approach will be more like a piano.

Now, why this advanced guitar playing will be an outcast from Jazz guitar world?


3) Now if I am comprehensible on this account may I ask you say a few words to develop Polyphonic Improvisation?

The linear improvisations are mainly common in Jazz guitar and unlike Piano the polyphonic augmentation of improvisational ideas are not seen in the playing of Charlie Byrd or Laurindo Almeida or Romero Lubambo. They played the polyphonic composition and improvised in a linear manner. Only the polyphonic thing is visible in your compositions and playing ....... therefore I am asking in two different threads about the polyphonic ideas you are developing instantly or you feel like writing them first?

Actually I’m summoning up my courage to play Jazz compositions in Classical guitar. I actually asked you a question here in French
viewtopic.php?p=209875#p209875

By the permission of the moderators I would like to add a deleted question.
Please do not delete this time …. Hee! hee! :)

4) I am an Indian Classical musician and I like the interesting composition India from your Libra Sonatine. Can you please explain the background of this piece?

(Sir, you don’t have to answer this last question just letting you know that your compositions are very much inspiring)

Merci beaucoup Monsieur
J’espère que je vous rencontrerai un jour.

Au revoir

Sobers

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GeoffB
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Re: Classic Jazz/Finger style Jazz

Message par GeoffB » mer. 24 novembre 2010, 16:53

Sobers a écrit :4) I am an Indian Classical musician and I like the interesting composition India from your Libra Sonatine. Can you please explain the background of this piece?

(Sir, you don’t have to answer this last question just letting you know that your compositions are very much inspiring)
The answer to this question can be found here: viewtopic.php?f=166&t=24583#p210246
and, as Sobers says, he does not expect it to be answered a second time.

Geoff

Roland Dyens

Re: Classic Jazz/Finger style Jazz

Message par Roland Dyens » mer. 24 novembre 2010, 22:57

GeoffB a écrit :
Sobers a écrit :4) I am an Indian Classical musician and I like the interesting composition India from your Libra Sonatine. Can you please explain the background of this piece?

I wrote this right after I saw the famous Indian movie "Le salon de musique by Stayajit Ray, the great Indian film Director.


All best Sobers. Hope our paths will cross some day, anywhere in our small world..


Roland Dyens


(Sir, you don’t have to answer this last question just letting you know that your compositions are very much inspiring)
Merci beaucoup :merci:

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